No worries mate !

"But I think that the idea of video reports has something going for it."
Agreed Dodgy👍 A 'virtual Roving Reporter' would be nice.
"Does the site have a Youtube Channel?"
Not that I'm aware of, don't think so either.
That would be a question for Fireboat (Stephen), but I'm sure if there was one I would have stumbled across it by now.
As mentioned before; I think if we want to continue this theme we should start a new thread under 'Site related stuff'.
Martin's original question was answered way below so we should terminate this thread now.
Cheers, Doug 😎

Certainly, if you wish. It looks as if the different connection capabilities of many possible attendees would make video chats hard anyway.

But I think that the idea of video reports has something going for it. Does the site have a Youtube Channel? We could have our own 'roving reporter'...

Hi John
" Would be great if we could work out a cheap way to video group chat."
"That's another fine mess you got us into Olly"!
😁😂 Cheers, Doug 😎

"But the number of signals multiplexed into each channel is still a factor in the bandwidth you will obtain. "
I see you are trying to teach an old COMMS engineer to suck eggs Dodgy!😉
You have your views / interpretation, I have mine.
Let's just leave it at that.
Ciao, Doug

I'm almost the same as you Doug. 52.34 down and 9.54 up and I'm on the cheapest plan possible and the speeds are pretty much what I pay for on my fiber connection. Can go higher, but of course the cost follows it. I only just manage to use 60 GB a month (my plan allowance) and sometimes only use 40-50, so it suits me. Was on unlimited but it was wasted on me.

"...At the moment you cannot find out what your contention ratio is. The average used to be 50:1 for home customers and 20:1 for businesses, but improvements to broadband infrastructure have rendered these figures obsolete...."

Ah - I see what you're thinking. The statement that the figures are 'obsolete' refers not to the fact that speeds have increased, but to the fact that these ratios used to be fixed. For all modern networks they are now dynamic, which is why you cannot 'find out what it is'. It is changing all the time. But the number of signals multiplexed into each channel is still a factor in the bandwidth you will obtain.

Dynamic contention rations are set by algorithms, and modified on the fly by humans with knowledge of the likely load. Mobile phone bandwidth, for instance, would be increased considerably around Wembley during a Cup Final. Extra mobile Base Stations are put in place during events like Glastonbury to maintain adequate service. So contention ratios are not 'just statistical planning tools' - they really have an effect. If you monitor your service throughout the day you should see the network 'breathe' - expand and contract as the load comes on and off it. Unless, I suppose, you are on a link which is kept at a static high service level for Emergency Network purposes...

"...Bad luck with your connection DG ☹️...."

I'm not unhappy about my connection - it's likely to be as good as fibre can make it. The point is that I have considerable local contention, since I run several web servers and other services through the same connection. Anything I measure on my local browser is affected by other computer users in the building, external phones using the local hot-spot and, of course, people browsing the web pages or downloading. I could only get a 'best service' reading by closing all this down - which would make the kids and wife unhappy, at the very least... :( Though it might save me a fortune on internet purchases of dresses and shoes...😊

Just ran another quick check using the local Vodafone Kabel Deutschland server: 50.9/8.9Mbps 😊 Earlier I ran a test using T-Com's own Speed Checker; similar results. But Speed-io gives more info and a choice of servers. I even tried one in Innsbruck, coupla hundred km away in Austria. Not so good but still usable.

Seems a weird situation altogether for you guys Red, my commiserations!☹️
🤞 for the new Google cable!
Doug

Dont know what you have all got to grumble about - we probably have the slowest internet around - plus the fact its the most expensive in Africa too. Half the time connections are dropped when logged into gmail to add insult to injury. Something to do with bandwidths that are not available says our supplier - not that we tend to believe it all, There has been a big scene with fibre cable being laid all over the country - main centres first of course but Google apparently will be laying another cable from Europe to be completed by the end of next year which will supposedly speed things up. Not holding our breath.
Notice another thread hijacked by us all..........

We've just been surveyed for it, the surveyor told us it is just over 30 miles away at present, the other side of the county. But he said that they would start in our area in October 2021 but it will go live in early 2022.
BT aren't having anything to do with it, it's a private company hired by the county council. But anything to do with the local council takes ages. The best of it is that the SAS CAMP have had fibre since they moved here. Pity we can't link to that as they have mega speed. That's why it takes ages to do my research. Got to go visitors just arriving.
Cheers Colin.

Surely can't be that bad Colin!?
That's worse than the old 64k modem days! 😮
Have you tried the Speed.io link I posted?
Don't have fibre in my street yet either, but it's getting closer every day.
You can track the progress by the damn roadworks!
Cheers, Doug 😎
PS I'm typing this veery sloowly so that your connection can keep up😁

Lucky beggar. The best speed we can get is 5.7kbs/ 175bs. Here in rural Herefordshire.
And its getting slower all the time. No fibre in our location yet but could be here in 2022.
Cheers Colin.

PS just tried the Speed check again using two nodes closer to me in Munich than the one in Mühldorf, 2 miles instead of 43 miles. Same results. Slowest rate was 50.9/8.9.😊
I'll give it another bash in the morning.
Cheers, Doug 😎

Bad luck with your connection DG ☹️
Attached two screen shots of Speed Checks I just did on my 50/10Mbps connection, at what is probably one of the peak usage times. 20:05 and 20:12.
Looks like I'm getting what I pay for 😊
http://www.speed.io/

Re Contention Ratio-
https://www.broadbandcompared.co.uk/guides/what-is-contention-ratio
"How do I find out my contention ratio?

At the moment you cannot find out what your contention ratio is. The average used to be 50:1 for home customers and 20:1 for businesses, but improvements to broadband infrastructure have rendered these figures obsolete.
Should I worry about my contention ratio?

No, it is very unlikely that your speeds are severely hampered by contention ratio. If you are noticing slowdown at busy times, it’s more likely to be an issue with your home Wi-Fi network than a wider contention ratio issue."


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contention_ratio
"Issues

One of the issues with a stated contention ratio is that it is not, on its own, adequate for comparing services. There is a huge difference between 1000 users each on a 2Mbit/s service sharing a 40 Mbit/s pipe, and 50 users each on a 2 Mbit/s service sharing a 2 Mbit/s pipe. In the latter case two users trying to download at the same time means each get 50% of the speed. When there are a 1000 users it would take 20 users maxing out their 2Mbit/s link at the same time to show any congestion. However both of these would be quoted as 50:1 contention.

Contention ratios are essentially just planning rules which are used to design a network offering (typically) an Internet service. The perception of the quality of that service will depend on the actual usage of the users of the service. This is partly why rules such as 20:1 for business and 50:1 for residential users came about. The actual usage demands of users have changed over the years and for evening/weekend traffic residential users can be demanding a lot of bandwidth making 50:1 contention ratios inappropriate. Contention ratios also only really make sense if dealing with relatively consistent speeds. The fact that a single back-haul in the UK could have users at 500 kbit/s and users at 100 Mbit/s makes normal contention ratio planning a thing of the past. In practice, a well run network aims to avoid links hitting limits, and upgrades the links when they do - this only works where the pricing model allows extra revenue to pay for the higher usage links and this is hitting some "unlimited use" tariffing models.

A further problem with contention ratios is similar to Erlang on telephone lines. If there are a small number of users then the peaks and troughs in usage will be very visible to each user, if however the same contention ratio applies to a large number of users then the probability of being affected by the contention can be much smaller. In telephony 20 users each likely to make a call 10% of the time need 8 lines to ensure that there is less than 0.1% chance of being blocked. When we multiply the number of users contending for the service by 10, the number of lines required is only 35 which is less than 5 times the number of lines required for the same probability of being blocked. The same issue applies to broadband service."


There are several other similar appraisals and comments on the net.

"We need the contention ratio to know what you actually get .."
An odd comment really as we can never know this since it's only a statical planning tool.
and there are 'lies, damn lies ... and statistics' so I never trust any statistic that I haven't falsified myself😁
JFF I just did a 3rd test:- 51.2/8.9, Ping 12mS, Jitter 1mS. I'm happy😊
Cheers, Doug 😎

"Consensus of the IT pundits seems to be that Contention ratios are no longer particularly useful in the days of Broadband and ever more local exchanges...."

Ah, well, as an IT pundit I would like to see where that consensus was specified. It's an obvious requirement that the line usage should allow you to hit a reasonable speed. Perhaps that's a consensus from the telecoms companies? Just wait for the Internet of things to hit the communications lines....

But in practice so many variables will affect your speed that it's pointless to try to predict it. Particularly as you can use a speed checker to find out what you actually have, minute to minute.

I note that I am on a 100Mbps fibre optic line to get an 'average' upload of around 6Mbps for the web servers, but in practice my average download over the day has been about 75, and the average upload on the web circuits was about 2! The browser goes through an external proxy which limits the speed, of course, but the web servers only go through a local hardware firewall....

I saw him once, but was unable to speak to him as I was steering my canal boat. He lived at Long Buckby on the Grand Union Canal. Genius.

Give, give, give OF that foodage and stuffy.
I have the originalk vinyl somewhere.

Martin

And after a little lapse of time, Stan became deep hungry in his tumblode, for he had trickly trickly how several milode and anywo would suffer under this. So sitit down. out with the lunchy box, just about to take a little niblode of his mincey meaty, when?
Stan Unwin, Happiness Stan -Small Faces- Ogdens' Nutgone Flake if I'm not mistaken. Deep Joy and happiness emanating from the cocklodes of our heartstrings, wot

You may have heard this, one of his best I think. (addressing motoring writers at Earls court motor show)
Mad John

Hi Dodgy,
Consensus of the IT pundits seems to be that Contention ratios are no longer particularly useful in the days of Broadband and ever more local exchanges.
Anyway, here's the spec of the product I use T-COM Magenta M.
Even the minimum quoted would seem to be more than enough for Skype & Co.😊
At the moment still copper, FO should be installed shortly. My GF who live a couple of miles away already has it.

".... but I wonder if a pool-side broadcast might be another alternative? ... - so all you would need is a member with a good battery, a firm mobile link and an open-ended contract..."
Doesn't that bring us back to the cost factor raised by John?
Also, even with a good battery constant constant video streaming would probably pretty soon flatten it☹️ A decent video camera hooked up to a Laptop / Notebook with a Hotspot connection might be better?

Suggest if this topic progresses that it be continued in a new thread, of appropriate title.
Under 'General Resources' or 'Hobby Chit Chat' perhaps?
Cheers, Doug 😎
PS
T-COM has just announced their prices for 5G mobiles and Flat Rate.
€900 for a Samsung 5G phone, €85 / month for the Flat Rate.
Plus a warning that to use the full speed you need to be close to the cell antenna!
"Am Mittwoch startete die Telekom auch den Vertrieb erster 5G-tauglicher Smartphones und 5G-Tarife. Das Samsung Galaxy S10 5G wird für knapp 900 Euro angeboten. Der 5G-Tarif für unbegrenztes Surfen kostet knapp 85 Euro im Monat. Das sind fünf Euro mehr, als die Telekom bisher für ihre "echte" Datenflatrate mit LTE-Geschwindigkeit aufruft.

Mit 5G sind allerdings Downloadraten von bis zu einem Gigabit pro Sekunde (Gbit/s) möglich, mit LTE sind es bis zu 300 Megabit pro Sekunde (Mbit/s). Um von der vollen Geschwindigkeit des 5G-Netzes profitieren zu können, muss sich der Nutzer allerdings in der Nähe einer Antenne befinden."

"...Max 50Mbps download, 10Mbps Upload, option for 100/40Mbps if I want, which also answers DGs query..."

Well, not completely. We need the contention ratio to know what you actually get - 'max' is never achieved in practice. But being able to watch films means that you could view a stream.

These comments came from the thought that a video link might be set up for board members to chat. I suspect that the free WhatsApp facility for four would be worth trying, but I wonder if a pool-side broadcast might be another alternative?

Here we would be thinking of 'covering' various club meets around the world - say, Mayhem Wicksteed Park or Fleetwood in the UK, and no doubt others in Germany, the US, etc... Smartphones can be used as webcams - see https://www.windowscentral.com/how-use-your-android-phone-webcam-streaming - so all you would need is a member with a good battery, a firm mobile link and an open-ended contract...

Ah, now THAT, I understand. Deep thoucus, Oh yes.

"wonderboldness and deep, deep joy" Martin 😊

“Are you all sitty comftybold two-square on your botty? Then I'll begin.
Now, like all real life experience stories, this also begins once a polly tito, and Happiness Stan, whose life evolved the ephemeral colour dreamy most, and his deep joy in this being the multicolour of the moon. Oh yes. His home a victoriana charibold, the four-wheel folloped ft-ft-ft out the back. Now, as eve on his deep approach, his eye on the moon. Alltime sometime deept joy of a full moon scintyladen dangly in the heavenly bode. But now only half! So, gathering all behind him the hintermost, he ploddy-ploddy forward into the deep complicadent fundermold of the forry to sort this one out.”
― Stanley Unwin
😎

Makes more sense than all your techie talk!

Martin

Hi John,
"I think I was referring partly to cell phones here which use a data usage plan ( as do your home PCs for internet),"
No John, that's not the case here in Germany. I have a Flat Rate Internet and IP phone connection for €39.95 / month. Max 50Mbps download, 10Mbps Upload, option for 100/40Mbps if I want, which also answers DGs query. Copes with the Skype requirements without getting out of first gear!😊
There are no data restrictions/prices unless you want to buy cloud or server space, which I don't. Have enough external 2TB drives for my purposes.
I can watch films, missed TV programmes, the snooker tournaments live with no extra cost.

My comment was thus directed solely at Smartphone / Cellular / Mobile / Handy (what ever you want to call it around the world!) connections.
I also have a smartphone but it's only used for phoning and SMS when I'm travelling.
I occasionally use internet when away from home BUT, only with my Kindle Fire and then only if the villa or hotel I've rented has a free WLAN connection or in a free Hotspot.
Natch I don't use such connections for purchases or anything sensitive of course. Just looking up maps and such like.

Specially for Martin's (Westquay) benefit here's (most of) the above in Croatian (sort of)😁😂
Cheers, Doug 😎
Bok, Johne.
"Mislim da sam se djelomično odnosi na mobilne telefone ovdje koji koriste plan korištenja podataka (kao i kućni PC za Internet),"
Ne John, to nije slučaj ovdje u Njemačkoj. Imam flat rate Internet i IP telefon priključak za €39,95/mjesec. Max 50Mbps preuzimanje, 10Mbps upload, koji odgovori DGs upita. Nosi se s zahtjevima servisa Skype bez dobivanja iz prve brzine! 😊
Nema ograničenja podataka/cijena, osim ako želite kupiti oblak ili poslužitelj prostora, što ja ne. Imam dovoljno vanjskog 2TB pogona za moje potrebe.
Mogu gledati filmove, propuštene TV programe, snooker turnire uživo bez dodatnih troškova.

Moj komentar je tako usmjeren isključivo na smartphone/Mobil/Mobile/Handy (što god želite nazvati oko svijeta!) veze.
Također imam smartphone, ali se koristi samo za telefoniranje i SMS kada putujem.
Ja povremeno koristiti Internet kada daleko od kuće, ali, samo sa svojim Kindle Fire i onda samo ako je ili vila ili Hotel sam iznajmio ima besplatnu WLAN vezu ili u besplatnoj Hotspot.
Natch ne koristim takve veze za kupnju ili bilo što osjetljivo, naravno. Samo gledam karte i tako to.

Lord knows what that translates back to English as 😮

Yeah, I'd twigged he was just being a 'smart Alec'😉
Never 'eard of 'im!
BTW: don't remember what I put on the Post It!?
Doug 😎

So you did! I'd clean forgot. His name is Mark Digby. Newly(ish) retired so about "our" age?
He was, of course, taking the piss!

M

And as Maxwell Smart used to say "and loving it"!

Hi Martin,
What was the guy's name?
I went to King Edward VII school in Kings Lynn back then.😉
Cheers, Doug 😎

Hi Doug, I think I was referring partly to cell phones here which use a data usage plan ( as do your home PCs for internet), you can choose anything from 60G to unlimited (smart phones) which includes text, phone and internet. My phone is just a prepay, - phone and text,- as I have the computer -fibre connection- for internet (plan includes land line, email, 60G $75 per month) and never use internet away from home
If I'm just doing this stuff I use very little but if I start watching movies etc, obviously I will use a lot more. As I said I'm not sure about the system there but am assuming it's similar. I don't like using apps anyhow as I don't trust a lot of sites for security reasons, as you so rightly point out.
P.S was doing that in my sleep so probably was not making sense 💤
John.B

Well, I took the dry cells to the club and had to prove to them that rechargeables do NOT fit a DX5e, but Duracell dry cells did. They were all astonished having called me a Luddite for not having rechargeables, even though I've been around rechargeable AAs for ages as my digital workshop radio uses them, but even that struggles to accommodate just 2 of my many sets, the others being far too large to fit comfortably., Several flyers brought me their batteries and none would fit my Tx. Unfortunately there is no socket to plug a made up pack in either. So, Duracells it is.

Doug, I still had the post-it note on the Tx. from you and one wag there said, "Oh, Doug in Munich? We were at different schools together!" Took the others quite a while to twig what he'd actually said!

Martin

Ah, well - I only came in half-way through the conversation, when the issue was boat plan access. Some comments on your original post:

1 - You want reliability in a remote control link. So any issue that is actually causing a reliability problem should be addressed.

2 - People may comment that some designs or components are unreliable. This may or may not be true for your case. It's worth checking anything that someone suggests may be unreliable, but not changing it unless you have good evidence that it is.

3 - People have complained about the use of individual batteries (rechargeable or not) in a radio control, on the grounds that each individual battery clip connection is a source of possible failure. Rather depends on how clean you keep them, and how springy they are...

4 - people often discuss rechargeable vs dry-cell issues. There are many possible variations and considerations, so everyone can support their own preference. Initial nominal voltage is not really an issue, as batteries provide a range of voltages as they run through their discharge cycle. More important is the battery 'life', which is something you need to find out for your own particular system/battery/usage mix.

5 - One good thing about dry batteries is that you can buy fresh ones at short notice, so you can use them immediately. One good thing about rechargeables is that they (usually) have more amp-hours and a flatter discharge curve. But you have to care for them a bit, and make sure they are charged before use... see the reference below.

I tend to think that for occasional use, and use at short notice, dry batteries are useful. But for regular continual use rechargables win out. Incidentally, there is a newish battery design (Sony Eneloop and Vapex Instant) which offers very low self-discharge. I've tried them and it's true. You can charge them up, put them away and use them a year later. As good as dry batteries. But, of course, they cost...

https://www.powerstream.com/AA-tests.htm

Oh I bought some Duracells yesterday in answer to my original post. Now off to the club to get the guys to show me how it all goes together, I hope!

Martin

I think this post has lost its point. Gone from model boats and batteries via model shops to the wherefore and why of social media!

Hehe! I see this site has adopted Serbo-Croat as its default language. You gotta go back a few posts before you hit English again!

"...I wouldn't touch What's App with a 20 foot barge pole, or Facebook, Twitter and all the others for that matter. Given their misuse of personal data as well as all the hacker attacks they have suffered..."

I'm not sure that I understand what the issue with What'sApp is? Their messages are encrypted end-to-end using Public Key, so there is no way that anyone except the recipient can read the message. What's App certainly can't, and they store very little data about users (though if you use What'sApp for payments you should not be surprised to find financial transactions being stored).

What'sApp is cordially disliked by law enforcement services precisely for this reason. Remember the issues the FBI had over Mufid Elfghee? And that was before encryption.

There is quite a difference between the various social media messaging systems in what they offer, and what they do with the data. They do not all operate like Facebook. If you are particularly worried about secrecy you might like to look at Wickr, Signal or Telegram...?

Incidentally, I assume that your DSL is Asymmetric? If so, it may be your upload speed which limits any video conferencing? I can't believe that it is limitless - it must have a maximum speed.
Here are the current Skype recommendations as an illustration:
https://support.skype.com/en/faq/FA1417/how-much-bandwidth-does-skype-need

Hi John,
Don't know quite what you mean by SMS 'Plan' but I can assure you (as a former programmer of the first automatic cellular radio test systems) that there is no way that SMS (= Short Message Service) could have the capacity for video streaming, or even audio for that matter. As the name suggests!

"Trouble is, here (don't know how it works there) is that all internet is on some sort of usage plan" True, if you insist on using 'Dumbphones'.
I use almost exclusively a PC/DSL connection and the only restriction I have is how much I can leave / archive in my Mail account which is stored on the provider server, 1GB max currently. Could buy some more, but what for?
What I do on the Web is irrelevant.
So all I need to do is occasionally clean out my Mailbox; deleted, sent, received etc.
What I want to preserve I transfer to a hard drive, either as eml or pdf..

BTW: I wouldn't touch What's App with a 20 foot barge pole, or Facebook, Twitter and all the others for that matter. Given their misuse of personal data as well as all the hacker attacks they have suffered it simply confirms the impression I got while involved in the early days of the net and especially the various cellular systems.
I also did some programming on UK Type Approval test systems and could recognise the expansion possibilities of the cellular radio systems; all the large data blocks labelled 'Reserved for future functions' and filled with zeroes!
I had to first analyse the data exchange between mobile and cell site to then devise a suitable test protocol.
With the increase in usable bandwidth this 'availability' has since expanded considerably, not always for the benefit of the user - ever more for the provider!
This site is the only 'social site' I'm on, I trust Stephen (Fireboat) far more than Mr Sugarmountain and Co.

Regarding some sort of 'Group chat', great idea by the way; perhaps a VPN?
Maybe Ed (Figtree) could help us with setting up something like that?
Cheers, Doug 😎

Just had a look DG and it seems that it uses your phones internet connection...

Yes. Everything now uses the internet transmission protocol - even, in most cases, your normal land-line phone. Free service will assume that there is reasonably unlimited internet provision, which is the case in most populous areas in the Western world, but can be a problem out in the country...

Live streaming discussions are often provided by web sites - I don't know if there is free software for these which lets external people join in...but you are correct that video - particularly HD - is going to chew up bandwidth...

Just had a look DG and it seems that it uses your phones internet connection rather than through your SMS plan. Trouble is, here (don't know how it works there) is that all internet is on some sort of usage plan (mine is the lowest at 60GB per month) and if you start connecting through a video link it's going to chew through data. I'll ask my son who is a bit of a whiz at finding free on-line stuff.

I think that WattsApp gives you a free video call with a limit of 4 people - I haven't looked at what's available on open source, but I wouldn't be surprised to find a video conferencing service available...

Is that with video, DG ? Might be worth a look

Hi Doug, I was meaning more here in NZ, as I know you have some nice shops in the UK and Germany etc ( I have bought quite a bit from Cornwall Model Boats who give really good service) and a few years ago was buying IC engines and parts from Just Engines in Shaftsbury who were a great bunch with spot on service and advice. A list of good shops would be great Doug as if you are not in the country you quite often don't get to know good local shops.
When I was working on Norfolk Island (SP) in the 70s there was a shop called the 'Mini Golf shop' owned by a lady named Agnes who was incredibly knowledgeable on all aspects of modeling ( it's where I bought all my models, motors and radios at the time as they were tax and duty free, - bought an OS FS 60 motor when they first came out for around $160 Aust for eg, in NZ a year later they were about 6-$700 NZ). The shop was tiny (about the size of a double garage and was packed to the roof with model stuff from all around the world,- a real modelers paradise and it was known worldwide . Sadly it has been gone for many years as the tax system changed due to Australian interference, (they have now taken over completely) and is now just Lego and other crap (although at one time they sold more Lego than any shop in the world from the new -1980s shop) . I doubt whether there would be many shops in the world as exciting to enter as that old one these days.

"Would be great if we could work out a cheap way to video group chat..."

I thought there was a lot of free conference call software. WattsAp does it, I believe...

It would be nice to find a few modelers of like mind here Martin, to give a bit more enjoyment of each others work, but I think most of them are too old now (or have snuffed it) and the young ones as I said are not interested and have phones glued to their faces. At least we can still all 'meet' fellow enthusiasts and take an interest (and learn new things) on a global level through the Internet, but it would be much better in person. Would be great if we could work out a cheap way to video group chat. No doubt by the time we all kick off it will be common practice with technology improving daily. Doing it by phone or I pad etc internationally is cost prohibitive.

No, Doug, I don't think it caught on with VW, although M-B made a lot of it later with a very crude version and I didn't really think anyone would OK the replacement of an air bag with a glass screened monitor! Daft idea! The CNC machined carrier for the rear central arm rest mounted computer was 10,ooo Dm of work and even that had a glitch that had to be filled with metal powder filled resin and covered with a small sticker! The PCs in the boot were intended to be miniaturised, of course, but Siemens and VW fell out, so none of it ever happened. I couldn't find out how to remove the automatic gearstick, so I sawed the bugger off! Took a team of "mechanics" a day to come down from Wolfsburg and replace it!
But, all in all, it was the best contract I had in Germany.

Martin

Hi Martin, There are still some 'Synchros' around!
Don't see any backrest monitors!?
Don't know if the ancient PCs are still alive though🤔
Cheers, Doug 😎
https://suchen.mobile.de/auto/volkswagen-passat-syncro.html

Hi Red,
" imagine his chagrin when my 10 GBP Maplin Xmas special outran his new fast hydro........"
I had similar fun when my 1/72 Type 1 U-Boot outran the would be speed boats when I got fed up with them running in circles round my sub. Lots of long faces from them and Deep joy for me😊 A pair of 385s on 12V pack a fair punch. Cheers, Doug 😎

Evenin' JB (or G'mornin!)
"You are pretty much on your own now with model boats"
Agreed ☹️ 10 years or so go I used to have company but the last few years very seldom, but then since I retired I avoid weekends when the Biergarten is crowded and overrun with kids with 'prodding fingers' and
"and hardly anyone sells boat parts any more, (Ebay and Aliexpress are the modellers friends now)"
Can't entirely agree with that! I must have around a hundred Bookmarks for model boats suppliers from all over the world. Many in Germany, Austria and Holland.
I'll see if I can put them in an export file for general use / exploration by the members. No promises, not sure yet if a universal file for various browsers is possible. I use Firefox.
What is of course endemic and a great shame is that the net shops are strangling the local model shops. Same here in Munich. What's left are a few aircraft (mostly copters and drones) and RC car shops and RTR toyshops. Except the toyshops, all a good hours drive away and expensive! For raw materials the net is practically the only option. I get most of mine from Krick.
https://www.krick-modell.de/en/
https://www.krickshop.de/e-vendo.php?shop=krick_e&SessionId=
Happy modelling folks, Cheers, Doug 😎

Haha, stammtisch...I haven't heard that since I stayed at a lovely country hotel near Sontra. The proprietor was an Anglophile called "Fred" and always welcomed his English guests to the Stammtisch with his family for English breakfast or Friday night Fish and chips, without fail. As a thankyou somebody smuggled in a Sky card so his guests could watch sports in the back room. In Germany then you were not allowed a Sky card oddly. Very happy memories of that particular contract, making the first car with monitors in the backs of the headrests and touch screen centre console. It took FOUR PCs in the boot of a Passat Syncro with beefed up rear springs to take the weight! CM2 it was called ...Car Multi Media. Laptop in the rear armrest pop up monitor in the dash where the passenger airbag was (!!). You could 'phone the car or e-mail it to open windows while you walked to it in the airport carpark, etc. Very new then, almost old hat now. I digress terribly!

The one friendly MBC i know is Victoria Model Steamboat Club in East london, the world's oldest model power boat club and one of which my Grandad was a founder back in 1904. Still very much a family club, despite its location in a less than desirable end of that stinking hole, London. I wish I lived nearer so I could attend some meetings, but with nowhere to park nearby, I ain't walking in knife country!

Martin

Evenin' Martin (W),
"but go to a British model boat club (if you can find one) and you'll be grunted at if you're lucky."
That was precisely my experience many years ago with the MBC here at the Munich Ostpark lake. Interestingly I haven't seen them for a few years now, and their 'Stammtisch' and equipment lockers have been removed!! I suspect that they strangled themselves.
Now I sail, mostly alone, from the same site 😊 See pic, from before the club table was removed!

Martin(555), there was a lot of one-upmanship with them too 😝
One guy regularly came with his large 'Wiesel' FPB, with a working 20mm Oerlikon cannon mechanism - NO not with live rounds!😮 But all he ever did was discuss the cannon at the Stammtisch. I never saw his boat on the watter!

What I did find back then was that some very old guys, who had served in the Kaiser's navy or the Kriegsmarine, were much more friendly and came over to chat, ask questions and share experiences when I was sailing my 1936 destroyer and/or 1936 U-Boot.
One had served on one of the first 'Torpedo Boat Destroyers' in WW1 !! He was very chatty and asked lots of questions about my 1/72 HMS Hotspur H01.
Another used to turn up with a huge (ca 2m) model of Titanic on a trailer. Superb model BUT; it played continuous dreadful Oompahpah music ☹️🙉 He was a nice guy though and very chatty, especially with a Maßbier (1ltr!) in his lifter 😊
Cheers, Doug 😎

One upmanship is everywhere - in all aspects of life - my cars bigger than your car - we have some semi rigid inflatable shark diving boats here - 35 to 40ft long - one being fitted with FOUR 300hp outboards - imagine his fuel bill ...........
At my old Model Boat club wealthy member used to turn up with the latest and best - imagine his chagrin when my 10 GBP Maplin Xmas special outran his new fast hydro........
Full size Yacht club was worse - fellow member turned up his nose at the offer of another members crane to put his 30footer back in the water - used a local "professional" crane hire outfit to do the job - ironic that the crane fell over whilst lowering his boat and helped sink it - larger crane required to salvage both - all this while the sneered at crane was successfully dropping a 40footer back in the "drink" at the cost of a bottle of scotch.

Haha, I think you might be right!

M