Hi Doug, thanks so much for your reply.

You're right.
Only one relay of this type is enough. The second is useless.

I redid the drawing.

The question was in message #35.

I didn't translate all the parts of your reply correctly, but I get the general gist.

The diode on the coil is absolutely necessary (unfortunately, I know the reasons why it needs to be there). You're right about that too, thank you so much for reminding me.

Regarding the sentence: "Most importantly, the coil energizes at 6 volts and can handle 40 amps."
It's clear, there's no doubt about it; the 40 amps certainly don't refer to the current flowing through the coil.
Very little current flows through the coil; in fact, it's managed by another circuit (the on-off switch that manages a low current). Moreover, those coils have very thin filaments.
The 6 volts refer to the coil's excitation voltage, and the 40 amperes refer to the current flowing through the switch controlled by the coil.
Sorry, I took that for granted.

Thanks also for the invaluable advice on the relay type. This certainly avoids the need for a second relay.
Do you think the relay I linked is "Break before make"? I think so, but I haven't been able to figure it out.

I wanted to ask if the circuit is OK as it is (see the new attached drawing), but more importantly, if this relay is correct, or which relay you would choose.
Could you tell me (if you don't have a reference model or type) just the general specifications?

Sorry Alessandro, Re 'I wanted to return to my question.' But what was your question?
Also can you explain what exactly you are trying to do and why you are wasting an unnecessary relay on the right in your wiring diagrams? Also you are wasting the NO contact in the one left in the diagram. Why the heck do you need 6 contacts? And why 20A?
BTW: the relay coil connections do not count to the number of relay contacts!

To switch batteries, or any other sources or loads, you should only need a single relay of single pole double throw type. Also make sure it is a 'Break before make' type, in order to avoid your fear of connecting the positive terminals of both batteries together.
To whit "What I'm not convinced by this scheme is the simultaneous mechanical action of the coils, especially because the batteries have different potentials and for a few moments I run the risk of them being closed in parallel. In that case, current would flow between them, with harmful effects."

Re; "most importantly, the coil energizes at 6 volts and can handle 40 amps."
I assume a translation problem here - the relay coil is unlikely to need more than 1A and has nothing to do with the contact rating, i.e. the maximum load current that the relay can reliably transfer without burning the contacts.
BTW: You WILL need some diodes!
Simple signal type diodes (max 1A) across the relay coils to suppress the back EMF pulse created when the relay coil switches off, which otherwise can destroy the output transistor of the switching device.
Doug 😎

Good evening everyone, after the long discussion about AGM batteries, I wanted to return to my question.

If you don't want to read the entire message because it's too long, you can read the questions at the end and, if you'd like, give me your opinion and advice.

I confirm that mechanical switches that support large currents are too large (at least I haven't found any) and, I must say, also very expensive.

I found some relays that might be suitable for my needs.
One is the Bosch JD2912 DC relay (I'm attaching the technical specifications for anyone interested) or similar.
It's very compact and weighs just 35 grams, but, most importantly, the coil energizes at 6 volts and can handle 40 amps.
The only problem is that it only has five contacts. Since two of the contacts are for the coil, three remain for just one contact.
To switch from one battery to another, I need more contacts.
I thought that with two relays I should be able to switch from one battery to the other according to this scheme (see drawing no. 1).

I don't like it very much; I would have preferred a single relay with multiple N/O or N/C contacts.
What I'm not convinced by this scheme is the simultaneous mechanical action of the coils, especially because the batteries have different potentials and for a few moments I run the risk of them being closed in parallel. In that case, current would flow between them, with harmful effects.
In other words, I'm not sure that the opening of one circuit and the closing of the other would occur simultaneously. This wouldn't happen with a single coil controlling all the contacts.

Actually, in another circuit I made to switch the power supply from a 6-volt battery to a 12-volt one (with the same ESC that only supported 8.4 volts), I had no problems, even though I used multiple identical relays (unsoldered and recovered from the same board).
When operating the remote control stick (throttle) beyond a certain limit, the direct circuit from the 12-volt battery kicked in (bypassing the ESC, which was therefore not damaged).
The coil's excitation threshold was only reached with the throttle stick fully depressed because I had created voltage drops on the line that prevented the coil from exciting with lower voltages (supplied by the ESC with the stick in intermediate positions).
However, despite this positive experience, I'd rather not take the risk.
I'd prefer to use a single relay because the switching would certainly be instantaneous and simultaneous.
But I need to find the right relay; so far I haven't found one and I don't even know if it exists.

The current to the relay excitation coils can be controlled by an RC on-off switch (which I already have). In this case, I can draw the current directly from the receiver (as in the second attached drawing, yellow outline) or draw it from a 6-volt battery using another type of double-wire on-off switch (which I also already have).

Do you think the circuit would work?
I wanted to ask if you've ever used or found online 6-volt relays with multiple switching contacts (at least 6) capable of handling at least 20 amps.

I've also considered adding a diode, but I'm still trying to decide.
I've found ones with a low voltage drop (Schottky diodes), but I can't find any that can handle high currents.


https://www.amazon.it/gp/product/B071GT8TDW/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2PK0A3Q62GQUP&psc=1

Hi Roy, there are hundreds of models and types of AGM batteries.
Furthermore, other non-AGM VRLA types, even more expensive ones, have different and often better characteristics.

Hello Alessandro, I thought there maybe a new perhaps lighter and better SLA battery around.

I have used Cyclon cells, lead acid, but very similar in actual discharge capacity to NiMh cells. They do not seem to be around much any more.

These are AGM (Absorbed Glass Matte) but measured at the 5 hour rate as NiMh cells are. The SLA batteries are measured at the 20 hour rate.
Roy

Hi Roy, you're right, my answer to your question could be labeled TLDR; however, if you notice, the first part (divided by the series of dashes) is very short and succinct.
For the second part, I myself advised that the rest could be skipped.
The following section shows that the batteries I used are VRLA AGM, and there are general indications on the technology used and the differences between the various technologies.

In reality, the batteries I use (I don't only use FIAMM; I've used that brand as an example for a concrete reference) are SLA (hence VRLA) as you say, but more precisely, VRLA AGM.
SLA is another way of calling VRLA.
Since AGMs are a subfamily of VRLAs, I'll just call them AGM (an AGM is still a VRLA, which is still a lead-acid battery).
Saying that the batteries I use are lead-acid isn't wrong, saying they're VRLA (or SLA) isn't wrong, but calling them AGM is more accurate.
If you look closely (see the attachments), the FG batteries I mentioned and used are also AGM. The manufacturer itself writes and calls them VRLA and AGM.

I understand your point, Roy. AGM batteries, like all lead-acid ones, have the major disadvantage of weight, but if you no longer use them and don't intend to use them, I don't understand why you asked me where to find them.

Even though I was looking for advice and opinions on a mechanical switch (to switch from one battery to another), I'm very happy that the discussion has shifted to AGM batteries, because many people are still confused.
I'm pleased that the terms defining the various technologies (flooded lead, VRLA AGM, VRLA gel, etc., etc.) have been clarified.
Many continue to see, read, and comment about AGM batteries without knowing they're AGM. Or they think AGMs are only used for start-stop systems in cars.
For this, I have to thank Roy for reopening a topic I'd already discussed.
In fact, these AGM batteries I use, which are indeed very small, are nothing new; they've been around for quite some time, and we've discussed them in many build blog and forum threads. I'm always happy to revisit these technical topics.

There is nothing personal here for you, I was surprised the new technology in batteries had gone into small batteries.

I just wondered how many members of this forum were aware of the batteries now in their cars.
I mentioned my experience, there was nothing in there for you, or about you, Alessandro.

I Googled the battery you mentioned and read the technical details. I note the FG graded batteries are referred to as SLA in their own literature. Apparently similar to the good quality batteries we get Yuasa etc.

Personally, I stopped using SLA batteries some years ago as the weight to power ratio was unfavourable compared with NiMh batteries. I do not like LiPo cells but that is just my opinion.

Experience also tells me that long documents frequently get the initials TLDR.
Best regards
Roy

Hi Roy, I think you're a bit off track.

You wrote:
"Cars with stop/start function have to use a different battery than the standard type battery and cost twice as much."
Well, I never actually said I used batteries for the start/stop function of cars.
I explained to you in detail which batteries I use (including their dimensions) and, to avoid any misunderstandings, I also included photos.
I then told you where I get the batteries I use, not others I don't have. Certainly not the ones for the start/stop function of cars, which I don't use for my boats.
Also, I never said I used EFBs.

In short, I didn't understand the meaning or connection of your last message with my answer. I immediately thought it was a translation error and reread your question and my answer several times.
You asked me:
"I didn't know you can buy small Absorbent Glass Matte batteries?"
and I showed you the ones I use; I wrote down the dimensions. I'll leave it up to you to decide if they're small.
Then you informed me you have one in your car.
Okay, fine, but I don't know it; I can tell you about mine, not the ones I don't use.
Finally, you asked me where to find them, and I answered "where I find mine," obviously not the one you're referring to.

I'm sure I understood your question correctly and answered it correctly, but I could be wrong, so if there's anything unclear (I'm sure I explained myself poorly) or you have any other questions, please let me know; I'll be happy to answer.

Thanks for the detail.
Cars with stop/start function have to use a different battery to the standard type battery and cost twice as much.
Quote:-

One technicality though, a normal lead acid battery cannot run this system, so special batteries are needed: Absorbent Glass Mat (AGM) and Enhanced Flooded Batteries (EFB).

The EFB batteries are for the larger cars altough also work for smaller cars.

Other information I have come across requires a special charger with a lower cut off voltage for the charge voltage.

I got into this as I had an old battery monitor from my last car which I plugged in to my current car and it said I need to re-new my battery.

But apparently the battery voltage is limited to 13 volts for the advanced batteries but the old lead acid batteries are allowed to have 2.4 volts per cell i.e. 14.4 volts on full charge.

Confusing? Yes but with 60% of the cars in Europe on S/S need these batteries.

Roy

Hi Roy.

The AGM batteries I used are those in the first three photos.
There are different voltages (V) and electrical charges (Ah) for this type of lead-acid battery.
For simplicity, I'll refer to the FIAMM brand.
I currently use three inexpensive models of this type:
1) the 6 Volt, 4.5 Ah (dimensions: 106 x 47 x 70 mm) that I used for RC ship models; see the fourth attached photo (FG 10451).
2) the 12 Volt, 7.2 Ah (dimensions 151 x 65 x 100 mm) that I used for my alarm control unit; see the fifth attached photo (FG 20721).
3) the 12 Volt, 2 Ah (dimensions 178 x 35 x 67 mm) that I used for my alarm's external siren; see the sixth attached photo. (FG 20201)
4) I recently replaced the batteries in the control unit and the external siren of my alarm (which I installed myself years ago). The batteries weren't meant to be thrown away, so I currently use them to power the remote controls. With a small modification, I avoid wasting eight 1.5-volt AA alkaline batteries, which are not rechargeable. See the seventh photo attached.

I know many people simply call these batteries lead-acid batteries.
The term isn't incorrect, but it's very generic.
For example, the batteries we use in common cars are lead-acid, but they contain liquid and can't be turned or flipped. The liquid can be refilled.
Another type of lead-acid battery is gel.

AGM (Absorbent Glass Material) batteries are part of the VRLA (valve regulated lead-acid) family.

I can't find them in auto parts stores or even regular electronics stores.
I can find them in large electronics stores or in shops specializing in alarm and video surveillance supplies.
I can also find them online (for example, in the RS catalog).

The above answers your question; you can skip reading the rest.
Wikipedia also provides a brief description of VRLA technology and explains the differences between AGM and Gel.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Copy/paste Wikipedia EN

A valve regulated lead‐acid (VRLA) battery, commonly known as a sealed lead-acid (SLA) battery,[1] is a type of lead-acid battery characterized by a limited amount of electrolyte ("starved" electrolyte) absorbed in a plate separator or formed into a gel, proportioning of the negative and positive plates so that oxygen recombination is facilitated within the cell, and the presence of a relief valve that retains the battery contents independent of the position of the cells.[2]

There are two primary types of VRLA batteries: absorbent glass mat (AGM) and gel cell (gel battery).[3] Gel cells add silica dust to the electrolyte, forming a thick putty-like gel; AGM (absorbent glass mat) batteries feature fiberglass mesh between the battery plates, which serves to contain the electrolyte and separate the plates. Both types of VRLA batteries offer advantages and disadvantages compared to flooded vented lead-acid (VLA) batteries or each other.[4]

Due to their construction, the gel cell and AGM types of VRLA can be mounted in any orientation and do not require constant maintenance. The term "maintenance-free" is a misnomer, as VRLA batteries still require cleaning and regular functional testing. They are widely used in large portable electrical devices, off-grid power systems (including uninterruptible power systems), motor vehicles (as traction batteries for light electric vehicles such as golf carts and as starter or auxiliary batteries for heavier vehicles) and similar roles, where large amounts of storage are needed at a lower cost than other low-maintenance technologies like lithium ion.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Appendix. Some specific product features. This serves as an example to understand the others.

The Fiamm FG battery range is specifically designed for optimal performance and protection from electrical faults. The high-quality battery ensures no electrolyte leaks from the case or terminals. This battery requires virtually no maintenance thanks to its perfectly sealed structure and the recombination of gases within the cell.
This battery series uses a unique electrolyte suspension system incorporating a microfine glass mat (AGM) to retain the maximum amount of electrolyte in the cells.
Features and Benefits
Optimized for discharge up to 20 hours
5-year design life in flotation operations in a temperature-controlled environment
Gas recombination and VRLA AGM technology with 99% internal recombination
Spill-free and maintenance-free
Non-hazardous material for air/marine/rail/road transport
100% recyclable
Applications
Alarm systems
Communication equipment
Emergency lighting
Fire and security systems

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Differences between LEAD ACID and VRLA (AGM and GEL)

Lead acid batteries are made up of a set of cells composed of lead and sulfuric acid. These chemical elements allow the battery to produce electrical energy repeatedly and be continuously recharged. They were the first rechargeable batteries developed in over a century and still play an important role in the generation of energy for many machines today.

Lead acid batteries are chemically composed of lead and sulfuric acid; the term AGM stands for Absorbed Glass Mat, indicating that AGM technology batteries are internally composed of glass fibers that completely absorb the electrolyte, preventing it from flowing freely.
AGM batteries, also known as VRLA AGM batteries, are constructed as sealed lead-acid batteries. They have a plastic casing that makes them stable, watertight, and resistant to external agents. Even if the plastic casing were to break, there's no chance of acid leaking out because the electrolyte is permeated by the glass fibers.
It's reliable and can withstand oblique positions and strong vibrations without damage; these characteristics, among others, are what make AGM batteries so famous.
The hermetic seal, in addition to allowing the battery to be positioned anywhere, eliminates the need for replenishing the battery's liquid reserves, whether water or acid, as occurs with open batteries, specifically flooded lead-acid batteries and common starter batteries. This is because after each use, when the battery is recharged, the electrolyte solution within becomes available again within the glass fiber mesh, for a new reaction under the same physical and chemical conditions as before.

On this page, we find gel batteries, which are lead-acid batteries; That is, they have the chemical structure of a classic lead-acid battery, composed of lead and sulfuric acid, with the presence of another chemical component, silicic acid, which gives the electrolyte the consistency of a gelatinous liquid, hence the name GEL.
It might seem like a small difference, but this chemical characteristic, creating a different consistency in the electrolyte, triggers a specific chemical reaction in energy production. The gel electrolyte allows the battery to have greater resistance to acid, which determines differences in performance compared to other lead-acid batteries. Consequently, these differences also develop in discharge, in the battery's resistance to stress, and in its maintenance. Another factor is the internal construction of the battery separators, which allows it to function with both deep discharges and very shallow discharges.
The first characteristic resulting from the greater resistance of gel electrolyte to acid is its limited suitability for use when high starting currents are required, such as for starter motors. The particularity that makes it valuable is its resistance to deep discharge. Thanks to the gel electrolyte, they have high Ah capacities and a long expected design life. Gel batteries can be used cyclically and, while capable of recovering quickly from a discharge that is not very deep, they can also withstand deep discharges without suffering damage. They offer high capacity and recharge slowly. These are the main differences that make gel batteries preferable to AGM batteries.

Hello Allesandro, I did not know you can buy small Absorbant Glass Matte batteries? I have one in my car as most people will have who have stop start technology fitted.
Let us know where to find them please.
Roy

MODIFICATIONS AND IMPROVEMENTS

The receiver on the 1:60 RC model has eight channels, so I have a few free channels.

Adding LEDs would be very easy, but I wouldn't know how to make them realistic; I should have thought of that during the design phase; it's too late now.

The smoke simulator is no longer possible.

I could add the sound simulator if I had the space left.

I was instead thinking about increasing the battery life.

I currently have one AGM battery (6 Volts, 4 or 4.5 Ah) for the receiver, servo, and winches; the other, identical one, is for the brushed motor via the ESC.
Obviously, if I'm using the engine, the battery connected to the ESC will drain much faster.
Leaving aside for now the circuit I had imagined to automatically switch from a flat to a charged battery, I have two solutions.
Remember that all options must take into account the limited space available.

The first is to add a small battery pack for the receiver-servo-winch section and make both 6-volt AGM batteries available to the electric motor, which would need to be connected in parallel (theoretically yielding 8 to 9 Ah).
This would double the range.

Consider that the initial project called for three AGM batteries (6 volts 4.5 Ah) connected in parallel, but with the use of a BEC (built into the ESC).
This solution was discarded during construction.

The second solution instead involves the use of one AGM battery (6 volts 4 or 4.5 Ah) for the receiver-servo-winch section and an identical one for the electric motor, plus a NiMH battery (7.2 volts 3 or 4 Ah) that takes over when the first one is flat.
A lithium battery would be much more powerful, but I'm one of those who fear this type and only use it if it's irreplaceable.
As already mentioned, I'm leaving aside the automatic switching circuit for now and relying on manual switching via a dedicated servomechanism.
The problem remains of finding a suitable mechanical switch (to be moved with the servomechanism).
The ones I've seen so far (both slide and rotary) are suitable for the purpose but don't support enough current.
The ones that support high currents are too bulky.
For this reason, I was considering building one myself. To be safe, I'd have to use a lot of copper empirically.

The advantages of the first solution are many.
I have a small space in the bow that can accommodate a battery pack without affecting the longitudinal trim because the two AGM batteries can be moved a little forward and a little back within their housing.
I don't have to make many modifications, just the wiring. Restore the positive cable of the BEC and connect the two 6-volt batteries in parallel.
I know many people don't like parallel connections, but I adopt these precautions:
I use identical batteries and charge them so that they have as close to the same voltage as possible (when empty).
I connect them in parallel only when I turn on the circuit, never before.
I don't use any diodes.

The disadvantage is that I can't do anything when the batteries are dead.
Traveling far from shore can be dangerous.
In fact, you might notice that the motor battery is running low because even at maximum speed the ship moves much slower.
In this case, if you're close to shore, there's no problem getting the model ship back, but if you're very far away (with a headwind), you might not be able to.

The advantage of the second solution is that you can safely return the RC model ship even if it's far from shore. Sailing with the second battery can be omitted or done only near shore.
The downside is that the 4Ah NiMH battery, being very long, doesn't fit in the bow compartment. So either place a smaller battery with less Ah in the bow, or place the NiMH battery on top of the AGM batteries, raising the model's center of gravity (even if only slightly).

In the future, I'd prefer to try the second solution.

Has anyone built a switch like I described (to switch from one battery to another), or have you purchased one that meets the requirements I've described?

Sorry, the initial title is wrong. The lake is Turano, not Paterno.



So, as for the plans.

Of course, I need to make sure the cameras are working properly the day before the water test, and that's a given.

I want to use my smartphone by trying to put it on the second vessel. If that proves impossible, I was thinking of some sort of barge (even an RC one, but I already know I don't have time).
Alternatively, I can build a simple removable dock (four pillars to insert into the shoreline and a wooden plank to rest on top).
This idea came to me on the day of the second voyage (September 4th) when I didn't know where to position my smartphone.
The approach to the coast won't be as impressive as from ship to ship and in the middle of the water, but at least the smartphone will be stable.

I want to try again with underwater and onboard shots.

I plan to put up some homemade wind vanes (two or three at most) to see the wind direction in the middle of the lake.
I think it will be very useful.
I don't even intend to make one into an RC model because I don't want to waste a motor, servo, and receiver, or a lot of time.
They'll essentially consist of a large floating surface, a ballast (deep to limit leeway), and the actual wind vane or flag on top.
They'll be hand-launched, so they'll be 15 to 20 meters from the shore, or maybe more (how many meters can you throw a large rock into the water?).
But all this will be useless without wind.

For the recovery, I hope to be able to do it with the boats themselves and not have to go out with the rowboat. This last time, I didn't even have time to inflate it.

The best thing would be aerial shots with a drone. A friend of mine told me he'd come with his DJI if I called, but so far I haven't.

These are the ideas I came up with while I was at the lake and on my way home.

Do you have any other fantasies?

I also thought about doing some fast navigation (off-scale) and then reducing the speed in post-production. I'm curious to see how the result turns out.

So these are my plans.
Improvements in the next post.

A few of you got it right about history, especially on that of the model you have. Plastic kits might have a short paragraph on the history of the kit printed on the side of the box. Perhaps that instilled in me to do the same for those that I have, whether a kit, scratch built, etc.

I do this with my tanks, vehicles, and my boats: I have a log book for each model which contains build information, drawings, photos (model and real boat), as well as the history including the marine architect and build yard plus specs. (See photos.)

Maybe an overkill, but I usually include info on the model for future repairs such as paint brand and color, electronics, parts info and more, and even instructions on how to open the model if it is complicated.

Also, Ronald, I agree to put this subject to rest. Let those out in Washington State figure out what they want the mountain to be called.

Lew

Good evening everyone.

As I mentioned in a previous message, I wanted to share with you some resolutions and improvements I'd planned for the third upcoming water trial.

But before this message, a few considerations come to mind.
I don't mind at all when a topic broadens the scope and sparks interesting discussions; I find it fun and productive. I'm pleased.
I also find it positive to broaden the discussion to include history and historical insights.
As good old Pat used to say (and I agree with him on this), if I build, restore, or buy a scale naval model, I want to know everything about that model (the ship's history, the historical context in which it operated, technical characteristics, any anecdotes, etc.).

I can't help but notice that some people (I don't remember exactly who now, but if you're interested, I'll surely find them with a search on the forum) have always expressed their annoyance at digressions and their intolerance for deviations (even the slightest) from the main topic.
The same people have expressed impatience with the display of information gleaned directly from the web through easy copy/paste or references to internet links.

This inconsistency sometimes borders on hypocrisy.
In Italy they say: "He who preaches well but practices badly."

I wrote this just to reassure you.
Don't worry, any further insight into this topic is welcome.
Any insights from your memories or personal knowledge are welcome.
Not only that, all internet links are welcome.
I'll go further; you can also copy/paste from Google.

As I have said before, come for the model boats, stay for the history . . .

And the point... ? Lew

Lew

I am done on this subject

https://www.puyalluptribe-nsn.gov/news/puyallup-tribal-language-consultant-publishes-first-comprehensive-analysis-of-the-many-native-names-for-mount-rainier-%25CA%2594uhuy%25C9%2599x%CA%B7-ti-d%E1%B6%BBix%CA%B7-pipa-%25CA%2594%25C9%2599-tii%25C9%25AB-qa-sda/

https://www.mountaineers.org/blog/the-case-for-tahoma

https://cascadiabioregion.org/department-of-bioregion/native-palce-names-from-mt-rainier-to-tahoma

This evening I was continuing my post storm clean-up (nearing the end) and found an article I had written in 'The Florida Frontier Gazette" (winter 2006). It was about Seahorse Key while in the hands of the Confederacy during the US CW. There is some information on the USS Tahoma which you might find interesting in association with the model in this forum topic.

"On February 1, 1862, the U.S.S. Tahoma arrived off Seahorse Key, and at about 1,400 yards shelled the redoubt and the woods, and with no return fire, dispatched two armed boats to land and reconnoiter. The island was abandoned. He saw “two long 18-pounders, vents spiked, trunnions knocked off, carriages destroyed.” The lenses had been removed from the lighthouse, and “nothing portable of any value (the lumber excepted) remained on the key.” It was noted that there were many live-oak trees and palmettos on the key which “would last a long while for firewood.” Also, the light keeper's house would “provide comfortable quarters for officers, and there was lumber enough for extensive barracks.” The light-house itself would make a good lookout station."

and...

"The Tahoma’s Assistant Paymaster J. S. Turnbull died on February 6, 1862 and was buried on Sea Horse Key near the rebel redoubt. “His name, date of his death, name of ship, etc., were cut in the headboard of his grave."

On October 5, 2005, four of my friends and I visited the island (accessible only by boat) in uniforms of the period and held a small prayer service at the site of the graves (photo 1). (Photo 2) One of the guns spiked by the Tahoma's crew, now located at Cedar Key.

Lew
(For 20 years, an amazing period of my life researching and reenacting the nautical aspect of the American Civil War period.)

Ronald, I see that what you posted was from Wiki. It is listed that the naming convention for the 23 gunboarts was based on Native American Indian tribes. I guess that the US government didn't have Wiki back then to rely on accuracy.

Anyway, I plan on making a Video on an article I wrote about another 90 day gunboat about 20 years ago, the USS Ottawa, a name that you are probably very familiar with. (It was a historic first.)

Lew

Okay, Ross, I'll try editing with "Morning" in the background.
I don't have the audio file available right now.
If you have it and want it, you can PM me.

Thank you Lew

I was wondering what the balance was between sail and boiler. So, sails were more for an emergency, used when the boilers couldn't function?

Lew,

“ Tahoma is a sacred Indigenous name for Mount Rainier.
The name has roots in the Salishan linguistic family and Lushootseed, the language of the Puyallup” First Nations people.

Yes they may have named the ships using First Nations names but not necessarily the name of that group of people.

Ross, from what I gather from "The Official Records of the Union and Confederate Navies During the War of the Rebellion", sails were used infrequently back then. There are many instances (reports) that the ships were "coaling" at a port but more commonly from a tender.

The US east coast was broken up into two squadrons, another squadron for the Gulf of Mexico, and one on the Missippi. They were well supplied (coal, water, food, ammo, mail, reports, etc). Repair facilities were not too far apart.

Most ships, especially on blockading duty, kept their fires burning for immediate use for pursuing blockade runners. Often, they would not even anchor. No time to light the boilers and build up steam to chase a runner.

Giving this data, I can assume one would rarely see a sail/steamer under sail power. One instance could be an issue with the boilers, mostly scaling. But most of these boats could go on for weeks, even months before needing repairs, even boiling salt water.

There are some instances where towing would be preferred.

Lew

Alessandro

MORNING works well with your shots of the boat on sunlit water👍

Ronald, yes, I misspelled "Tahoma". It was one of the 90 gunboats that the US had built in a hurry fir the Civil War. All of these boats were named after US Indian tribes. I am sure that you heard Tahoma, Washington State.

As I mentioned, the Tahoma fired several rounds from her 150 pounder gun into Fort Brooke (now Tampa) about 40 miles from where I live.

Lew

Hi Ross, I'm happy to answer your questions.

Yes, the model has a propeller and is powered by a Graupner Speed ​​700 brushed electric motor.
The current power supply is provided by two 6-volt AGM batteries, but 7.2-volt batteries can also be used.
For further details, I'll provide the link at the end of the text, but I can answer any questions directly if you'd like, as searching for old posts in that thread is almost impossible. It takes a lot of time and patience.

Yes, as I already said, the second voyage (September 4, 2025) was characterized by a total absence of wind.
During the first voyage, the wind was very light at times, but at least it was there, and you can see many parts of the video sailing under sail alone.
If you want to see the model sailing under sail alone, you should watch the first video.
When sailing under sail alone, they lean heavily depending on the speed and don't experience turbulence at the stern, caused by the propeller.

I'm thinking about some improvements, including those related to the power supply, which I'll explain shortly.

P.S. Since you probably missed the first part of the topic dedicated to building this model, I wanted to clarify a few things so you don't get confused.
I didn't intend to faithfully reproduce any Unadilla-class unit because I never had, and don't have, any plans for those ships.
My intention was to design a naval model from scratch.
Initially, the idea was to create a model that could sail with sails alone (since the previous one had sails, but they weren't controllable).
To create a realistic sail-powered model, I decided that a gunboat from the second half of the 19th century would be a good source of inspiration.
I already knew what they looked like in my mind, so I could do the initial sketch and the type of sail rig without consulting anything, relying only on memory.
When I came across photos of the Unadilla class, I realized that my ship closely resembled them, so I later decided to enrich the deck with elements from these ships and make them increasingly similar.
I therefore drew freely from them, relying only on a few paintings of the period.
Of course, I read and studied the history of the Unadilla-class gunboats and all the steamships of the second half of the 19th century.
In fact, I didn't always follow the original for various reasons.
For example, I only placed guns in batteries and none of the larger caliber cannons in chase guns or amidships, for practical reasons.
For example, I made the bowsprit too long due to my own stupidity and obsession with always making everything longer.
For example, I didn't place four lifeboats on the sides, but two on the sides and two in the center, for practical reasons.
However, please note that any differences were consistent with the period in question and found on other contemporary ships.
Mine is more similar to the USS Tahoma, the USS Cayuga, the USS Aroostook, rather than others that also have yards and square sails.

https://model-boats.com/forum/128542

Alessandro

Question:

Actually two, does this model have a separate motor driven propeller, and was the motor operating during the video?

A question more directed to LewZ and his knowledge of the history of this vessel.

If this was a gunboat, would the sails have been used for cruising and patrolling, and the engine engaged for pursuit if contact was made with an enemy vessel?

Alessandro, if this is the case, maybe use MORNING for the start of the 'patrol' and HEIMKEHR for 'engine pursuit mode' The two pieces of music are very different

Since the boats were built on the Clyde, could you use the SKYE BOAT SONG? (I'll go back to my room now. . . )

Thank you so much Stevedownunder for your kind words, much appreciated.

Thanks to everyone who liked the videos, not just likes.

Good morning everyone.

I understand that Ronald and RodC like silent videos; in short, they prefer no background music.
That's their opinion, and I should respect it, even though, as I said, I don't agree with it.
However, I don't plan on editing the video because they can simply hit the mute button or turn the volume down to zero and watch the video silently.

For RossM, things are different. Ross made some very specific and well-aimed observations.
I'd like to start by saying that I really appreciate comments that, in addition to criticism, also propose a solution and a more thorough evaluation.
Ross, thank you very much for your suggestion.
I'll look for this music and edit it into the video sequences, then I'd like to hear your opinion.

On a more general note, I noticed that you're all referring to the first two videos with music by the great Gioacchino Rossini, and I'm starting to wonder if you haven't actually seen the others.
In one of these, the music is by Mike Oldfield.
Don't you even like Moonlight Shadow and the other music?

We read this yesterday too

Hi Ronald digging up history can have some unexpected results.
You are right the boats were built on the Clyde.
So how were they paid for?
The finance came from cotton produced in the main by the slaves in the southern states.
This was traded in Lancashire which became renown the world over for its cotton goods.
The money from this was used to pay for the ships built on the Clyde.

Ironic for the slaves who picked the cotton and that their own labours were keeping the slave trade going.
Is it best not to know? This is not meant as a political issue, just history!

regards
Roy

Lew is this the same vessel? Your spelling is different than the one I found.

“The USS Tahoma was an Unadilla-class screw steam gunboat, one of 23 such vessels built rapidly for the Union Navy at the outbreak of the American Civil War. These "90-day gunboats" were designed for both ocean-going service and shallow-water operations, playing a significant role in blockading Confederate ports and riverine warfare, including the capture of New Orleans and the neutralization of blockade runners.”

In Glasgow, we have discovered that during the US Civil War, steamships, built in Glasgow, Scotland, were built here as blockade runners and purchased by the Confederacy as they had no ship building capacity.

Not to forget the Adagio from Spartacus by Khachaturian.
Roy

The Overture music was way out of place. The original ship (USS Tomaha, Unadilla class) was built in the U.S. and used in the American Civil War. It was based only 30 miles from my home for part of the War.

The video, with the model sailing smoothly in calm water, probably should have "background" music, but something serene. I rarely agree with Alessandro, but he is putting a lot of detail into a ship I have known (and written) about for around 30 years. So, I give him credit for building this model and hope he finishes it soon.

A common problem with many many videos is "framing" the subject". I tend to loose interest in photos and videos taken from high up at a distance. Hunch down near the water and let the boat sail close and slowly by. Record multiple takes, but get close in. Even a partial build invites close-ups.

Lew

Wonderful resalt Alessandro, pity about the camara.
Looked like ideal conditions on a beautiful lake.
Looking forward to seeing more videos in the future.

Cheers,
Stephen.

My opinion is that there be no music in a video of a vessel being shown on the water or even displayed.

My post graduate degree is in music but we are not creating an original sound track for a nautical movie. I like music in a film when the music is written for the audience and the music reflects the emotion or scene we are watching. The Music score of Master and Commander, or Victory at Sea.

Alessandro

maybe try:

HYMN TO THE SEA by James Horner.There is a nice version with just the tin whistle by Leyna Robinson-Stone

MORNING from PEER GYNT SUITE by Edvard Grieg

I would have to agree William Tell Overture is a little high energy for a cruiser sailboat

If you want to play up the gunboat and steam engine idea a little stronger, HEIMKEHR from DAS BOOT by Karl Doldinger

Hi RodC, thanks for your comment too.

So if I understand correctly, you prefer silent videos.
It's not about musical taste, it's not about which genre to choose or which song within the same genre, but simply that you don't like any of the music in this type of video. Did I understand correctly?

I greatly respect your opinion, although I don't agree with it.

In any case, the problem doesn't exist (or is easily solved) because every video player has a mute button, or you can completely mute the audio effortlessly and in no time.

My opinion? I dont care for the distraction of music in ANY hobby-related video.
Also, dont phone me if you keep the tv or radio on in the background...even tho i am a very skilled Amateur Radio Operator who can separate signals from each other & from noise, its difficult to separate the two streams of audio info coming into my ears.

No, i dont hav a hearing problem (was just tested, there is nothing wrong with my hearing).

Thanks for your opinion, Ron.

I've made several edits with different music.
Which do you like and which don't?
Is it just classical music you don't like, or do you not like the other ones either?
What background music would you use?
Or do you prefer not to add any music in the post-processing?
I'm interested in your opinion.

I would enjoy watching your model sailing even more if you didn’t use a musical concert accompaniment.

My opinion

Yes, Chris, the water is not only clean but also warm, so you can spend a few pleasant hours swimming.
Swimming in this part of the lake is also relatively safe.
I never trust lakes too much, even though I'm a great swimmer.

I recharged all the batteries the day before, but there were so many other things to do.
For example, installing and removing all the cannons to open the lids. Each cannon is tied at four points.

The system I created is very complex. In fact, when I officially hand it over to my son I'll have to give him a proper instruction manual.

You have access to a wonderful lake there with lovely clear water. Pity your cameras wouldn't perform.

Yes, I've been caught out before and now always prepare the day before including battery charging. But having done that, on one occasion I then forgot to take one of my transmitters! 🙄

Below are the YouTube links for those who can't open the video files.


Please feel free to ask any questions, concerns, or curiosities; I'll be happy to answer them.